With the Internet,
common names of plants have taken on a new dimension. We all know that some plants
have various common names, and that some common names (like Dusty Miller) are used to describe a multitude of different plants. However, we and our gardening acquaintances are usually familiar with the one or two common names out of several that can be used. With
the Internet, you are in contact with gardeners who live very far from you, and you realize that some of them actually use these names you read about but have never heard anyone use.
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| Are these common poppies, corn poppies, corn roses, field poppies, Flanders poppies, Shirley poppies or all of the above? |
I had two instances of this not long ago. Talking of Viola tricolor, Angie of Angie's Garden diaries wrote: "I have never heard the
name Johny-Jump-Ups before, it must a local one with you, Alain." In all my years of gardening, I have never heard anybody call them by any other name!
However, Wikipedia tells me that they are called heartsease, heart's ease, heart's delight, tickle-my-fancy, Jack-jump-up-and-kiss-me, come-and-cuddle-me, three faces in a hood, or love-in-idleness - Johny-Jump-Ups is not even listed! (by the way, how do you call them, Angie? you didn't say).
Anna, at Greentapestry, said "Interesting to hear you mention 'Kenilworth Ivy' as I've not heard the name before, only knowing the plant as ivy-leaved toadflax." In this case, it would appear that together we cover the whole spectrum as the only two common names mentioned for Cymbalaria muralis are Ivy-leaved toadflax and Kenilworth ivy. You would expect the name Kenilworth ivy to be British, I suppose, because of the association with the castle. It probably is, but it is the only name I have heard used in Ontario.
However, Wikipedia tells me that they are called heartsease, heart's ease, heart's delight, tickle-my-fancy, Jack-jump-up-and-kiss-me, come-and-cuddle-me, three faces in a hood, or love-in-idleness - Johny-Jump-Ups is not even listed! (by the way, how do you call them, Angie? you didn't say).
.JPG "Viola tricolor") |
| Viola tricolor |
Anna, at Greentapestry, said "Interesting to hear you mention 'Kenilworth Ivy' as I've not heard the name before, only knowing the plant as ivy-leaved toadflax." In this case, it would appear that together we cover the whole spectrum as the only two common names mentioned for Cymbalaria muralis are Ivy-leaved toadflax and Kenilworth ivy. You would expect the name Kenilworth ivy to be British, I suppose, because of the association with the castle. It probably is, but it is the only name I have heard used in Ontario.
.JPG "Cymbalaria muralis") |
| Ivy-leaved toadflax - Kenilworth ivy |
Language must always have been a big problem for plant explorers who would have needed interpreters. Having worked for 30 years as a translator/conference interpreter the subject interests me a lot.
The first prize for a convoluted translation process in a plant context has to go to the celebrated Lewis and Clark expedition.
They knew they would have to deal with the Shoshones and the famous native woman, Sacagawea, was asked to join the group as she spoke Shoshone. However she did not speak English. When Lewis or Clark needed to ask a question, they asked it in English to François Labiche or René Jessaume, two members of the expedition. It was then translated into French for Sacagawea's husband, Toussaint Charbonneau. He in turn, translated it into Hidatsa, the language he spoke with his wife, and she translated it from Hidatsa into Shoshone, her native language! You can well imagine that some of the answers must have had very little to do with the question, the meaning getting lost along the way!
The first prize for a convoluted translation process in a plant context has to go to the celebrated Lewis and Clark expedition.
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| Gaillardia aristata, one of the plants brought back by Lewis and Clark |
They knew they would have to deal with the Shoshones and the famous native woman, Sacagawea, was asked to join the group as she spoke Shoshone. However she did not speak English. When Lewis or Clark needed to ask a question, they asked it in English to François Labiche or René Jessaume, two members of the expedition. It was then translated into French for Sacagawea's husband, Toussaint Charbonneau. He in turn, translated it into Hidatsa, the language he spoke with his wife, and she translated it from Hidatsa into Shoshone, her native language! You can well imagine that some of the answers must have had very little to do with the question, the meaning getting lost along the way!
It's a minefield. And even if we stick to the Latin names it doesn't help because at the moment a lot of them are being changed!
ReplyDeleteI have also noticed a lot of changes in taxonomy. Many of the old familiar names will have to be forgotten.
DeleteI have never heard of the name Kenilworth ivy either. We have to stick to the scientific names; it is the only way that we can communicate and know that everyone understands what we are talking about.
ReplyDeleteViola is such a pretty name, and not difficult to spell or remember why would anyone want to call it anything else?
From a practical point of view, we obviously have to stick to scientific names but I like knowing the common names and see how different they are from place to place.
DeleteI've never heard of anything called Dusty Miller. I'd also stick with viola. I'd never heard of Johny-Jump-Ups either. I've heard mountain ash and rowan both used. As for the poppy maybe cornfield poppy or common poppy or native poppy for the red poppy that grows wild here - it's also the one associated with Flanders but those in the photo look like cultivated poppies that I would call Shirley poppies. One weed with the most names I've heard if is cleavers ior goosegrass,
ReplyDeleteThey are Shirley poppies but all the names mentioned are used for papaver rhoas.
DeleteI love to listen to you talk; I'm only good for looking at the flowers blooming. Will it ever be spring?
ReplyDeleteI became fluent in English only around age 23 or 24. I am sure that influences the way I speak (and write)!
DeleteI love common names. For example they are often so evocative of old places, country ways and customs and observed natural history. How about 'bee bum flower' which is an old name for the Hymalayan balsam.
ReplyDeleteBut so confusing. I used to tell my students that in the UK marigold was the name for both calendula and tagetes. I then move to my present home and the farmer has 'corn marigolds' in his field and they are annual chrysanthemums!
Yes, they are interesting. Bee bum flower is a good one. I also like kiss-me-over-the-garden-gate which not only is funny but actually rather a good description of the plant.
DeleteIt is interesting to wonder how all these names appeared. Some of them are very sweet. I rather liked jack-jump-up-and-kiss-me although I had NEVER heard that one before.
ReplyDeleteI suppose most are very localized names and that is why we have never heard them. I expect besides that many of the common names have a short life. There must have been many that were never recorded. I also like jack-jump-up-and-kiss-me but cannot imagine using it!
DeleteI love the common names of plants but use mostly the Latin names, certainly on my blog, for adding Dutch common names makes it even more complicated. For instance, field poppies we call ´klaprozen´.
ReplyDeleteI know exactly what you mean. Keeping the Latin name, the English name and, in my case, the French name makes it more complicated. Although the latter is often close to the Latin (if the Latin has not been changed recently!).
DeleteHello Alain, I've never heard of even one of those common names for viola tricolor! I tend to stick with botanical names to avoid confusion, but this isn't entirely safe either, with whole classes of plants being re-classified as scientific knowledge improves. What was once Dicentra Spectabilis is now Lamprocapnos Spectabilis (Bleeding Hearts or Dutchman's Breeches). How is one to keep up?
ReplyDeleteSome simple, evocative names, like Iris stylosa got more difficult (now i. unguicularis). The old name can still be useful. For instance, I can never remember if it is Campanula portenschlagiana I have or C. Poscharskyana. I know it is the ones that used to be called muralis so I can look it up using that name!
DeleteThese names in English mean nothing for me, I prefer to know their Latin names. In Russian most of names are different and may be 2-4 names for one plant.
ReplyDeleteThe Latin name is the only useful one but there is poetry in the common names.
DeleteI do use the Latin names but there is the odd occasion where the common name slips in. The Viola Tricolor, I would just call Viola. Apologies for not saying so at the time Alain.
ReplyDeleteWhilst we are on the subject of names......I have enough trouble trying to pronounce the latin names in my head - most of which I am almost afraid to say out loud when I go plant shopping, adding the common names into the equation would send me into complete chaos!
The same Latin name is often pronounced in different ways by different people. Just say it the way you think and don't give it a second thought!
DeleteGood point about all the levels of translations with the Lews and Clark Expedition! It must have been like the children's game of "Telephone," where a message starts at one end and travels through several people to the end. It's often totally different after going through several people. I'm so glad when people list nicknames and Latin when they describe plants. It helps! One funny thing is that sometimes I find it easier to remember the Latin names, and sometimes the common ones. Good topic!
ReplyDeleteIt is funny what one's mind find easier to remember. I realize that my mind is rather lazy. I often cannot quote the Latin name of a plant but remember enough of the first letters to look it up if need be! Very often the common French name is similar to the Latin one and it makes it easier to learn them together.
DeleteI always said 'Johnny Jump Up'. I try to use both the common and botanical names when I write. I find both fascinating, and like to learn about their origins. Good post.
ReplyDeleteI am glad there is at least one other gardener who uses the name Johnny Jump Up. It must be North American as a name. Like you, I prefer to use both the Latin and common names.
ReplyDeleteOn a personal level I have had to deal with this issue in organizing my plant tags. I have a binder where they are all organized alphabetically. But I found I faced a dilemma. How to file them- by latin name or common name. The problem I found is that for the rarer plants I had yet to learn the latin name. So I organized those rarer plant tags by the common name. Not surprisingly I ended up with a mess. So now I have decided to do an index of common names and the corresponding latin ones. I plan to file all the tags by the latin name.
ReplyDeleteI have the same problem with pictures of plants which I file alphabetically. However for vegetables I use the common name. It is a bit of a mess.
ReplyDeleteI love the local names for plants Alain, but find it difficult when looking at those from other countries, it's bad enough in the UK with some plants having numerous common names. Unfortunately now that the scientists have DNA analysis at their fingertips, I fear that we will only see more changes in plant taxonomy.
ReplyDelete